0:47EOh, my heart!
0:49Donnie GloverHappy 20th anniversary.
0:51EMy heart is about loving up on my sisters. Do you know what it feels like to have your sisters in the room? Johnny.
1:00AAnd dare to be different and unique. I’m gonna be the best me I can be by letting his glory shine through. I am beautiful, I am blessed, but not just what you see in the flesh. I’m free from people, free from myself.
1:21FThe doctor lived next door to the janitor, the janitor to the reverend, and the lawyer. We were together. Now we get so high and mighty that you create stress for your society because You look like 4 black holes together.
1:34Donnie GloverThat’s a health problem.
1:36FGet yourself together so I can stop being taking care of geriatric people and get back to pediatrics. I thank you, Donnie, for all you’ve done. Let’s keep doing it more and more.
1:47ALetting his glory shine through. Dare to be you. Dare to be me. Dare to be different than you and me. I’m gonna be the best me I can be by letting his glory shine through. And I dare you, I dare you, I dare you to be you.
2:13Donnie GloverFirst name’s Donnie, last name’s Glover. In it to win it for the long haul, baby. We have with us the one, the only, all the way from the Bay Area, Mr. Kamal Hubbard. Hello, sir. Happy Sunday to you.
2:26Kamal HubbardHey, Donnie. Happy Sunday. Thanks for making it happen on a Sunday evening. I know the Time difference always seems to throw us off from getting connected the way we want to, so I appreciate you taking time out.
2:37Donnie GloverIt’s all good. It’s a very important bit of news that you want to talk about. Let me just get it up here correctly. This is the Black Blockchain Summit, September 21st to the 23rd at Howard University.
3:00Kamal HubbardYeah, correct. So this is going to be the first year I’m attending, and in fact, I’m going to be working with the Internet Computer Protocol, ICP, their North American hub, to just go out there and speak about what this network is all about. I had an opportunity a few months back to speak to their folks here in their San Francisco office. And I said, you know, I want to raise awareness about what you guys are doing. And, you know, just threw the idea out there. They absolutely loved it and are supporting it. And they want to get, like I said, the word out around what the Internet Computer is all about, especially within our community. So, you know, I appreciate you once again for taking time out to allow me to speak about this subject.
3:56Donnie GloverSo let’s go through some basic vocabulary for the everyday person. I mean, my job is to help translate this to the everyday person. So what are some -- let’s start with blockchain. What is blockchain, Kamal?
4:19Kamal HubbardOkay, so blockchain is essentially a type of ledger. So a ledger is like a record. Ledgers are used typically by people like accountants, right, to track things like debits and credits. So, you know, you have a business and you need bookkeeping and you go to a bookkeeper or an accountant to do that for you. they’re gonna ledger all of your transactions, financial transactions and expenses, to see essentially at the end of the day how much something like taxes you owe, or once again, how many expenses you actually incurred during the course of a certain period.
5:07Donnie GloverSo that’s what blockchain is in the world of -- can we say in the world of crypto? Is crypto the broader term?
5:17Kamal HubbardYeah, yeah. So blockchain technology, once again, which is a ledger that is publicly available. So anyone right now can go online and access -- we’ll just say the Bitcoin blockchain -- and look at transactions as they’re happening in real time. So it’s completely public. and they can look at those transactions that are taking place on this ledger, uh, once again at all times, 24/7, 365. And that ledger technology once again empowers cryptocurrencies and, uh, as well as the Internet Computer Protocol. And what makes the Internet Computer Protocol a little bit different from other blockchains out there is it’s a type of blockchain that you can build anything on. You can build websites on it, uh, decentralized financial applications on it, games, metaverse, and all sorts of other things. And what it’s really been built to do is to eliminate the traditional IT services Things like Amazon Web Services and Microsoft Azure Cloud. So you can do, once again, all sorts of things like online storage without the use of going to those intermediaries anymore.
6:48Donnie GloverSo you hear Darius right there has a question for you about the 12 words. I know what the 12 words are. What are the 12 words?
6:56Kamal HubbardRight. So, you know, When you --
7:00Donnie Gloveris that skipping around? Is that -- are we going too soon to the 12 words?
7:04Kamal HubbardNo, I’ll, I’ll try to bridge the gap right there. So we talked about the blockchain being a ledger, and this ledger is essentially tracking coins or financial transactions going from one account to another. These accounts are what are termed in, uh, cryptocurrency speak, I guess, as wallets. So those accounts will have a certain amount of coins or funds on a particular wallet. And to create a new account or to create a new wallet, you have to have these 12 seed words, or what’s called these 12 seed words, that once your new account or your new wallet is generated Those 12 words act as a code in case you lose your wallet, right? Or you lose access to your account at some point and you need to restore it. If you don’t have those 12 words, then you’ve lost essentially all your funds in that wallet.
8:08Donnie GloverWow. How did you get interested in crypto, Kamal? How did it happen? Tell me your journey.
8:16Kamal HubbardYeah, well, uh, it’s been a long time since the first time I came across this, but I was actually studying the subprime mortgage crisis that essentially grew into a larger global credit crisis while I was at Stanford’s Rock Center for Corporate Governance, and I was managing research in federal securities litigation. So all those cases that turned into, uh, shareholder class actions against companies like Bank of America Wells Fargo, Citibank, JP Morgan, who essentially -- I’m not going to say allowed this to happen, but they didn’t necessarily have the right stops in place to divert that global credit crisis. In those studies, I kept coming across this thing called Bitcoin, which instead of having a centralized type of financial system, which is what we have, It’s transitioning more into a decentralized peer-to-peer financial system that takes banks out of the equation.
8:16Kamal HubbardSo essentially, it came about because, hey, banks created this crisis. So what would happen if we were able to have financial transactions by taking banks out of the equation? And so that really resonated with me, and I took 2 years of independent study just to understand what Bitcoin was and how it worked, and to see the fraudulent aspects and understand the fraudulent aspects. Because really early on, all people were saying is, hey, it’s a scam, it’s, it’s a fraud, it’s not true. And, uh, like I said, I took 2 years to understand the technology as best I could before I actually entered the market. But, you know, I always say if I had, instead of taking that 2 years to study and just gotten into the market, made my mistakes, which I would have made anyway, I’d probably be much, uh, better off than I am now and most likely retired and, uh, hopefully have some island money or something.
10:33Donnie GloverHow many -- what percentage of Black people are into this whole world of crypto, Bitcoin, and the like?
10:44Kamal HubbardWell, you know, I think the good thing about blockchain, metaverse, NFTs, crypto, and all these things that Web3 encompasses, and especially with the decentralized aspect of it, right, and not having to have that centralized authority to say, okay, hey, you can participate in this, once again, it, it’s very attractive to a lot of Black people who have faced historical discrimination in traditional finance. So I think there is a pretty high percentage of Black people who are involved in this, and they also see it as an opportunity to pursue financial freedom, once again, outside of that paradigm. So yes, and there was a Pew Research study that came out, I believe, a few years back that talked about Black people really adopting cryptocurrencies at higher levels than other communities because they see this once again as a means towards greater financial freedom.
11:54Donnie GloverHere’s a question from one of our viewers. Is there a way our people can become Bitcoin miners on a large scale? On a larger scale?
12:06Kamal HubbardWell, you know, that’s actually becoming more and more difficult. You know, there’s been a lot of talk recently about the company Grayscale, which is the largest Bitcoin institutional investor in the world, and they have what’s called the Grayscale Bitcoin fund, and what they’re also applying for is a Bitcoin spot exchange-traded fund or an ETF. So they are the largest institutional investor in Bitcoin, and they want to have a Bitcoin ETF. And while that is actually in process now, they are focusing on getting as much Bitcoin mining hardware as possible, right? So they want to have everything from end to end when it comes to the production of Bitcoin, the ability to make Bitcoin available to people in terms of traditional finance, and they want to have as much Bitcoin from a custodial standpoint as possible as well.
12:06Kamal HubbardSo To a certain extent, I wouldn’t say that door is closing necessarily, but you know, you have the large -- one of the largest players in Bitcoin from a traditional standpoint only wants to get their hands on more Bitcoin. I think to a certain extent a lot of people, a lot of other people do. And you know, this is why networks like the Internet Computer Protocol are important because it takes us away from the focus of solely being Bitcoin and how easy it can be to build these Web3 applications on something other than Bitcoin. But something that’s also interesting about the Internet Computer protocol is that it has been integrated into the Bitcoin network.
12:06Kamal HubbardSo Essentially, you can use the Internet Computer Protocol, ICP, to interact with the Bitcoin blockchain. So you can create transactions using this network much cheaper and much faster than you can, almost a little bit more secure than you can on the Bitcoin network, which is very interesting.
14:42Donnie GloverAll right, can you, can you say that in everyday people’s terms, in layman’s words language?
14:49Kamal HubbardRight, I sure can. So basically you can use this -- essentially it’s a more technologically advanced type of blockchain that can interact now with the Bitcoin blockchain. So if you wanted to send $5 of Bitcoin to someone, you would not have to necessarily log into your Bitcoin wallet and then send the funds and then pay that network fee, which at times can fluctuate. You can actually now use a smartwatch, in fact, to verify that sort of transaction. The Internet Computer protocol will allow for other devices to enable those things very easily, essentially at either the touch of a button the entry of a PIN code or, uh, like your fingerprint or something like that at a much lower cost and once again at a very high speed.
14:49Kamal HubbardAnd so like now I guess to make it an ex -- to use an example, if you have an Apple Watch and you wanted to send that $5 to someone in Bitcoin, you could do that. Hopefully that’s simplifying that example. And what’s currently also happening is integration onto the Ethereum network as well. So the Internet Computer is going to essentially be able to talk to all these other blockchains out there and become interoperable. So someone who is also on the Ethereum network or on the Bitcoin network can send you funds and you can receive it on the Internet Computer. Oh, you’re -- I think you’re on mute.
14:49Kamal HubbardI wasn’t able to catch your question.
16:52Donnie GloverOkay, so let’s go to this Black Blockchain Summit that’s happening at Howard University. You announced on Be More News that you have a collaboration with DFINITY and the Internet Computer Protocol. And as a part of this cooperative effort with, uh, Internet Computer Protocol North America, you’ll be covering the intriguing Black Blockchain Summit. Now, before we get into that, you are an expert, is that correct? I mean, essentially, people have been calling on you. You’ve done a show on it. Uh, somebody stole you away from our network to come and be on their network, but then we stole you back.
17:42Kamal HubbardYes. Yeah.
17:43Donnie GloverUm, tell them, I mean, how -- so what, what’s your -- what are your credentials? Why, why are you the guru? Tell them why you’re the expert. I mean, you’re a leading Black proponent of this. And because when I look at this Black and go to Black Blockchain Summit, uh, I’ve seen some names, uh, Alec Kanani, Ida Rilling, Arthur Hayes, Cameron Winklevoss, Cleve Messidor. I mean, these are apparently big names in the technology, people with companies, people -- sponsors include Bithub Africa, Afriblocks, Galaxy Digital Blockchain Association, Bitcoin Magazine, Black People in Cryptocurrency, National Policy Network, Women of Color in Blockchain. I mean, you, you are keeping us cutting edge. What -- who are these people? What What are your credentials?
18:45Kamal HubbardWell, okay, in terms of my credentials, I think I kind of touched on them. I’ve also written a book on decentralized finance. I’ve received certification in -- certifications in fraud examination, cybersecurity, and decentralized finance. Like I said, I wrote a book called DeFi for the Diaspora that makes the case for decentralized finance. As a way to once again take banks and traditional finance out of the equation to get greater economic global sustainability for, uh, the African diaspora, people of African heritage, and, uh, Black people who have been historically underserved and remain underbanked by traditional finance. So Um, you know, I, I remain humble and, and all that comes my way, so sometimes there’s things that I leave out. But, you know, I definitely am very thankful to the Black Blockchain Summit organizers. They have welcomed me with open arms as well.
19:54Donnie GloverHow did they find you?
19:55Kamal HubbardWell, you know, I -- so a lot of those people who are going to be there, I’ve either interacted with worked with them before. And so, and a lot of people I haven’t had an opportunity to meet and work with, but these are pretty much the brightest minds in blockchain and in crypto and in Web3. One of the chief organizers, principal organizers, is a gentleman named Skinner St. Clair, who he is an engineer by trade And he was in Bitcoin almost first or second year, and he’s done so much in the space. And I had an opportunity to meet him here in the Bay Area, and we actually had a really great talk the other day. And he just talked about how the summit is. It’s like everybody getting together, almost like a family reunion style sort of thing where we’re talking about how we’re gonna solve problems with blockchain, Web3, and crypto, um, to, to make a more peaceful world, to once again find economic, uh, sustainability for Black people who’ve been essentially marginalized by a traditional financial system.
21:18Donnie GloverNot all --
21:18Kamal Hubbardit’s not all Black people who are going to be there. We have some -- or they have some great sponsors. Once again, I was able to have a conversation with the Internet Computer Protocol and said, you know, is there a way that we can work to, uh, solving the racial wealth gap with your group? And they said, yes, we want to do that. We want to provide grants for Black developers and, uh, raise awareness so they can build on the Internet Computer. So that’s another thing I’m going out there to discuss is all these wonderful grant programs with the Internet Computer Protocol that folks at the Howard University Blockchain Lab can participate in, as well as just other attendees who are developers or people in the community who can understand what the Internet Computer Protocol is all about and raise awareness alongside the North American ICP Hub. So That’s, like I said, what I’m looking forward to, or at least accomplishing with this trip to the summit.
22:30Donnie GloverHave HBCUs in general embraced this blockchain technology?
22:35Kamal HubbardI think so. I mean, you know, Howard, like I said, they have a blockchain lab. I know that there is a very solid blockchain club that Morehouse has. In terms of other HBCUs, I think that they may have some kind of like extracurricular clubs out there that are focused on blockchain.
22:58Donnie GloverBut you would recommend that every HBCU have some type of crypto blockchain organization, club, hub, whatever, so that they could be at something like this, this Black Blockchain Summit, September 21st to the 23rd at Howard U?
23:16Kamal HubbardYeah, absolutely, absolutely. And there, there’s been quite a bit of outreach to, to try and create these sort of things by various other entities and organizations. Like I said, I’m committed to really raising awareness once again through ICP just because it allows people to build these decentralized applications at such a lower cost compared to You know, once again, having to use Google, having to use Amazon, having to use Microsoft to, you know, have the cloud infrastructure to do certain things, you just bypass all that, and that no longer becomes an overhead cost that folks would need to worry about. So getting some of these young developers to, to build these, these sort of ideas and applications can be absolute game changers in the next coming years.
24:18Donnie GloverSo tell me a little more about this summit. Is this the first time that there’s been a Black Blockchain Summit at Howard University? Is this the norm?
24:29Kamal HubbardNo, this is actually the, the 6th annual Black Blockchain Summit, and, you know, it got curtailed like a lot of conferences out there due to COVID, but, uh, I think they may have had in-person last year, but they’re in person once again this year, clearly. And, um, it’s just, from my understanding, only getting bigger and better.
24:56Donnie GloverWhat about African countries? Are our African brothers and sisters on the continent involved in blockchain and in this crypto technology?
25:09Kamal HubbardYeah, absolutely, absolutely. In fact, in a lot of ways, our African counterparts are almost a little bit further ahead than we are when it comes to some of the developments. And one of the people I want to --
25:23AWhy?
25:23Kamal HubbardWell, because a large part of it is being unbanked and having access to financial tools. Right? So if you don’t have a bank account and you can’t pay for certain things, then you have to find alternatives. And one of -- something that kind of proved this was years ago, Safaricom had basically a type of currency called M-Pesa, which allowed for people to have mobile phone units. Right, or mobile phone minutes, excuse me. And people used M-Pesa essentially as a currency. So they weren’t using their local currencies or national currencies to do transactions. People were actually trading minutes using this thing called M-Pesa to, to, you know, get things, get goods and services essentially.
25:23Kamal HubbardSo they didn’t have bank accounts, so they were using other services out there to facilitate financial transactions. So now there’s a very low barrier to entry, right? That proved that there’s a very low barrier to entry where as long as you have an internet-connected device and an internet connection, you can transact once again using cryptocurrencies, using decentralized financial tools, So it essentially once again takes banks out of the equation. The banks that were saying, oh, we’re not going to establish a branch because you’re in a certain country, right? Or your area is a little bit too rural for us. Now, if someone has once again a smartphone and an internet connection or a cellular connection, They can get the things that they need.
27:24Donnie GloverSo listen, we want to thank you for joining us. We got a couple of minutes left. Any final thoughts?
27:29Kamal HubbardNo, not at all. Um, well, I would like to share once again, I want to express my appreciation to the Internet Computer Protocol’s North American Hub for, uh, allowing me to represent them at the Black Blockchain Summit. all the Black Blockchain Summit organizers. And something I am actually looking forward to that goes along with your previous question is I’m going to be speaking to the ICP East African Hub co-founder there. So we’re actually going to be able to talk about what are the issues that are facing developers using the Internet Computer protocol in East Africa and how they’re able to build really some of these, uh, decentralized applications that are going to help the African continent. So I’m very much looking forward to that.
28:26Donnie GloverAre you at all surprised by the genius you find in our African brothers on the continent and sisters?
28:33Kamal HubbardNo, no, really not at all. And not here and not throughout the, the diaspora. one bit because, you know, it’s all the ingenuity that we have as a people have been able to tap into just throughout the years. Um, you know, so I’m not surprised, but I’m always astounded by all the new things that we’re able to do.
28:56Donnie GloverGood deal. How can people get in touch with you, Kamal?
29:00Kamal HubbardWell, find me on LinkedIn at, uh, Kamal R. Hubbard, as well as on Twitter Same thing, @KamalRHubbard. I’m also on, uh, Facebook and Instagram, so those are the best ways to find me.
29:16Donnie GloverAnd, uh, what is the name of your book again?
29:20Kamal HubbardDEFI for the Diaspora. D-E-F-I for the Diaspora.
29:26Donnie GloverAnd what’s it about again?
29:27Kamal HubbardWell, how we can create a global sustainable Economic system using decentralized finance.
29:38Donnie GloverGetting rid of the banks?
29:39Kamal HubbardWell, essentially yes, essentially yes. But the way things are going from a regulatory standpoint, uh, unfortunately due to all the fraud that took place in crypto and in years past, regulators are coming in and they’re basically looking to pass all this off to Wall Street.
29:58Donnie GloverSo, uh, how’s that gonna go?
30:03Kamal HubbardWell, we’re going to see. We’re going to see how that’s going to go. There’s always going to be people who are going to push back. But in a lot of ways, it may make things -- may make it easier for folks who have had difficulty actually onboarding and adopting cryptocurrency. So now let’s just say a Fidelity is able to make an app that makes it easier for people to buy Bitcoin or to have access or exposure to Bitcoin through an ETF. You know, that could be a good thing, but laws and regulation are always a few steps behind the technology. So if the technology is at a cutting edge, it’s always going to take some time for the regulators to catch up. So there’s going to be that space between, and as long as we can remain moral and ethical in how we operate in that space and we’re able to innovate, I think there is definitely an ability for us to do the sort of things that I discussed in my book.
31:05Donnie GloverGood deal. Kamal Hubbard, we thank you for joining us on this Sunday evening, and we wish you well at the Black Blockchain Summit coming up at Howard University.
31:14Kamal HubbardThanks so much, Donnie. I appreciate it. Stay safe and take care.
31:19Donnie GloverYes, sir. Good evening, world.
