Sirsu Interview

Transcript

0:00 It's just dumb. It doesn't work? It does, but you can't stop it. You can only start it. So now, I ignore it. All right. But booyah. Hello, everyone. Welcome to another episode slash piece of content from We Them Niggas. I'm out here in the Bahamas today, Nassau at Oasis on Chain, hosted by the wonderful Stephan Neliveau. It's been a phenomenal event out here at Crypto Isle. And I'm here with Sirsu, who you may or may not know. But, Sirsu, do you want to introduce yourself to the people? Yo, what's good? It's your boy, Sirsu. I manage Blackhand. I'm the co-founder. I normally run brand design and strategy. I've been doing this for about three years. My background is in service design, so I'm always thinking about how I'm building tools with the communities or with the clients or customers, kind of like in a sense of cooperation and collaboration and not really from like the heady like,

0:57 Oh, like we're collaborating but truly being in the mix with folks and yeah so started Blackhand about three years ago it was a Twitch streaming group during the pandemic we pivoted into esports did a crowdfund raised a million dollars started funding teams won a world tournament 2022 competed in Apex Legends placed third in the global championship last year and now we're just trying to build upon that momentum and and create the most accessible community-owned gaming organization on the internet, right? So that means you can own it, you can own it, I own it, and everybody else can. Okay. And, you know, I connected you through the crypto space through Mark, like, late, I guess, the year before, last one, 22.

1:45 Shout out to the homie. Shout out to the homie. And I'm super grateful. I'm not 20 black men I know in this space. And so to find one in Philly, I was like, okay, look at the luck of the Irish. Not Irish, but, you know, it came out of my mouth. We them niggas. Here we are. and so I'm curious like how does how would you describe crypto like how does that pertain to what you're doing esports like how does this support you and doing what you're trying to do creating this community-owned esports franchise brand team. Got it. Collective ownership is not really something that exists within Web2 ecosystem. The closest you get to it is sort of like Kickstarter and it has sort of like reward related incentives around kind of just like well if you find me I give you this sort of tangible thing.

2:25 And, like, while that does kind of work, it's not particularly scalable in the fact that, like, we can have participation from a global perspective, right? For the most part, you're not seeing people who are from India contributing to a Kickstarter fund, but you can see people from Indonesia, from Malaysia, from Singapore, from Dubai, for example, all collaborating in a crypto-native environment to own something. So Blackhand wouldn't be possible without crypto at all, right? So I would say fundamentally the idea of rallying people around a common cause and to fund it collectively is something that is very unique and dynamic to crypto that you just can't get anywhere else.

3:07 I've seen socially that globalized culture and accessibility to a global audience that for you makes this such a compelling space. Absolutely, because yeah, like esports is not necessarily something that's just relegated to Western countries. It's built all over Play is a composable and fundamental building block to everything that we do Play equals accountability, it equals excitement, it equals exploration, it equals collaboration, cooperation It fosters competition, both healthy and unhealthy, depending on how much you get into it It forms rivalries, it forms conflicts, and it teaches you how to resolve conflict Play is a very, very great teacher and a very great motivator And if you're limiting yourself to only play in the spaces where in a regulatory context only really means you're playing within your cul-de-sac

4:03 Then you have no way of learning from other folks on how they play and how they do things So for me, I feel like Blackhand is an opportunity for me, just as a person, to understand what that means to people all around the world And how those ideals may influence how I impact or how I build the future of what competition looks like on a global stage I like that, and as you've been working on Blackhand, I know Stadium is part of that project to envision the future of gaming So you speak a little bit about Stadium and what your vision is and how it's been evolving?

4:42 Absolutely, yeah So, if Blackhand's the megaphone and the brand and the culture around esports and sponsoring esports teams to compete, Stadium is sort of like the underlying technology layer, or protocol rather, that helps communities find talent, build talent, create events around competitive spaces. basically creating a center of gravity around where folks can compete and how they can compete with any particular game and it's not necessarily just video games even though that's our focus at launch right now but we see stadium as being kind of like the protocol for all types of competition so if you want to do a pickup game, if you want to play pickleball, if you want to do tennis

5:27 if you want to invent a sport for example then stadium should be the space in which that is possible And what does that mean? What does it look like? I guess, what's the underlying value this protocol is providing that makes it compelling to create my game on your platform? If I'm going to go play Gaga for my friends, what do we need Stadium for? Right, so Stadium is in many ways sort of like a Cerberus, right, or like a three-headed Hydra You've got on one end reputation, right, because your gameplay is on-chain Your wins, your losses, your earnings, the teams that you've played with All of your competitive history, both past and present

6:12 Especially since we're pulling data from Liquipedia and other places as well Then there's both methods of attestation where you can prove your competitive prowess And other people can prove it with you or for you But then secondarily that reputation adds an opportunity in which games, companies, brands can discover you And use you as a conduit to help them promote or push something Or give you exposure to new titles or new games Or an opportunity for you to become a king in a particular space So that's one Secondarily, there's a social component One thing about competition is that it directly correlates to fandom There's no other space right now that currently exists that blends the two things together

7:00 When you're competing, streaming is often separate from the competitive space that you're learning about are seeing how well your teams are performing. It's hard to find real-time data about how a competition is playing out and how that directly correlates to the people who are supporting you. Nor are there tools in which people can directly support you as an event is happening. And Stadium is sort of offering multiple solutions in that. Firstly, with embedded streaming. So as an event happens, you can stream directly onto Stadium and people can see your games as they happen. Secondarily, collaboration by contributing to a price pool. So imagine Weed of Niggas is hosting a very friendly, community-centered Halo event, right? And because I'm a fan of Weed of Niggas, for example, I decide, yo, I want to raise the stakes. It goes from zero price pool and I put $1,000 in there.

8:04 Now all of a sudden the top three teams or the top three people are now vying for that price pull amount But not only that, I'm also being able to say I'm showing fandom and support for let's say all the participants Or one participant in particular And then there's a particular portion of what I've paid for Or at least of my contribution that goes directly to that team Goes directly to the organizer Goes directly back into stadium and anyone else that's playing a role in making this event possible So now there's an opportunity in which value distribution, which I think is third, that is then being routed to all relevant parties at a given time instantaneously.

8:43 When you think about competitive spaces right now, I can tell you right now, for Apex Legends, for example, we earned $250,000 in total. Our split was 85-15, so 85 goes to the players, 15% goes back to us, and we're still waiting to collect our 15%. There have been issues with payment going to some of the players In one case last year when we won the Pokemon Unite tournament None of those players gave us anything We're currently in a dispute with them to receive the funds So sometimes this space is very unfortunate And it's not the crypto space, it's like the Web2 space And where we feel like Stadium has an opportunity to completely cut through the mustard

9:30 and create an equitable environment in which everyone is getting paid in a timely fashion and what they write for the dessert. Yeah, and it sounds like the trustless value distribution is a big part of that. You know, the predetermined agreements are honored, you know, on the blockchain as opposed to, you know, like, yeah, we'll do it. And it's like, when's the accountability? Exactly. And like, you know, the best thing about it is because it's a protocol, anybody else can build on top of it too and monetize the same exact way in which like we collect protocol fee, right? and so there's opportunities for organizers, for communities and folks to say hey like we can find, we can build community here on Stadium, we can create and grow fan base, we can compete directly with like the likes of other event organizers and do it in our own way, in a centralized way, in a way that like says hey when you fuck with us like you're not getting fucked with.

10:22 yeah so that's very dope and i've seen you on twitter talk a little bit about interest and interest in like entering the music space yes so what does that look like for black man um culture is everything right like one of the one of the other really good organizations in esports that has a great understanding of culture is XET um XET um yeah so it was partially co-founded by erin ashley simon she's uh an incredible she was a content Well, she's a content creator She's a really good, I would say, professional gamer And was on the broadcast side And did a lot of work in doing coverage

11:00 For a lot of unique events From, like, Call of Duty to Overwatch So on and so forth But she wanted to build, like, a place Where there was a blend between culture and gaming, right? And Xset was sort of, like, one of those fundamentals in doing that And so they have a really good, like, from their merchandise To the content creators that they support They fundamentally understand culture is what drives activity and action within this space Most people are very spoiled within esports or spoiled within gaming They don't pay for media, everything is pretty much free for them So there's little incentive for them to contribute

11:38 But I think within the crypto context and the opportunity where we can leverage speculation We can use culture as a identifier or as a hook to then bring people in to healthily speculate on the potential virality and value that Blackhand may have in the future But ultimately, I haven't seen anybody outside of us have a theme song We've got the heaviest of handshits, shout out to Ronin Black That shit goes fucking crazy Like, arguably, like, Blackhand is going for everybody's next because, like, our branding is superior, like, our merchandise is ridiculous And, like, I've been thinking a lot about, like, what do we sound like, you know, when people think about Blackhand

12:24 Like, esports is only but one stepping stone, but if we're building a community or we're building a culture around gaming Or browned around competition, then there's a level of ubiquity there, right? I want people to talk about us in the same vein and talk about the Lakers That's transcendent of where you're from, being from Los Angeles for example And having local allegiance, this is a global phenomenon People think about the Lakers because of players like Kobe Bryant And we may have the opportunity to do that from a player perspective But I think we can do it from a community perspective Which is the benefit of Web3

13:01 If any and everyone can rock the Black Kent banner then what does that truly look and feel like and sound like right and I think like it requires these artifacts of culture which is art which is music which is photography which is you know poetry which is voice you know these very tangible actions that like are replayable and repeatable you know they create mantras right like these are the things that like move a brand from oh yeah I know them from this Context, to I cannot get rid of them even if I wanted to, right? And there's a message with this stuff that I actually identify with, even if I kind of find it annoying that

13:44 like, why is like everything on Blackhand like in, on radio right now? On what? On radio, for example, right? Like that, that's, that's the idea, right? Like within five years, like, you know, we've produced artists that like, have records and have collaborated with folks Like Skepta, for example Like, you know, nobody really knows this But Blackhand, for Basel 2021, sponsored a West Side Gun concert That's hella crazy You know what I'm saying? So, like, when I made that tweet last year about, like, having West Side Gun rob, like, Brett Blackhand It's because I've already done the association in which, like, we supported an event that he was president

14:25 And it was fucking sick Dude brought out fucking Kano and did, like, a WWE match in the middle of this fucking set It's crazy So, like, these are the types of things where, like, we've been sowing those types of seeds And, you know, this is the year in which we start to really dial it up to a level That makes sense And so you're based in Philadelphia, I guess I'm interested in how do you see, like, yourself playing a role in the Philadelphia crypto scene Even the eSports scene, like, yeah So, like, thankfully, like, there's a LAN center called Localhost There's Nurture Gaming We've collaborated and done some stuff before

15:01 not necessarily from a Black Kent context per se, but when we've had teams play at Frackadelfia or play at the Nerd Street Gamers Summer Championship for Apex Legends, we've had really good relationships with them, building booths and supporting just the scene entirely. I think as it relates to stadium, that's where a lot of our impact is going to be more broadly. I think from a crypto perspective, Black Kent has a lot more of an identifier within New York City. So my focus is really kind of like building that up first and then siphoning a lot of that stuff back into Philadelphia Not that Philadelphia doesn't have a crypto scene, it does, it's just that like there's a lot more like groundwork that has to happen

15:45 And it's better for us, I think like, or at least personally, I think it's better to take a lot of the Or to borrow some of that like financial value, that stakeholder value, that brand value that I can get from New York and then move that into Philly as a form of creating goodwill and then Philadelphians and the folks like, let's say, Xfinity, for example, stuff like that, or Wells Fargo even, will be like, okay, we want to now contribute as sponsors to then build the Philadelphia scene. Philly is weird in that way where it doesn't necessarily matter if you're Native. They very much are like the South, the show-me type of thing. You kind of have to have motion in order for them to say, yeah, we fuck with you.

16:30 and it's a little annoying but at the same time it's like you know me like thinking about it anthropologically it's like okay I gotta just know that that's how the city works so I have to hack it a different way like why like swim against the current when I can just like go with something that's already working and then like the current ends up shifting because now like I have enough resources to build a dam. Yeah, now you can leverage those to actually empower the community those they're in Exactly That sounds dope, that sounds dope And I guess my final question is really like, what has being here out here at Oasis, you know

17:06 How is this impacting, I guess, your thoughts on the space, what you want to do this year Like, yeah, what's the value you're finding in being here?

17:14 Outside of the R&R potential that like the Bahamas has What does R&R stand for? Rest and Recovery R&D is Research and Development Exactly you gotta have some R&R too what's great is like what I've recognized is like Black Hat needs more of a physical presence in things like this and we do very well in grassroots environments and so I see a future in which like I'm able to even contribute here and when I think about like stadium and I think about like the opportunity and this protocol enabling competition to flourish in the global south and like bringing and cross pollinating these these environments, these these communities together is that like we can truly terraform the Caribbean islands and create a competitive viability here.

18:07 Right. Like I imagine where it's not just like N.A. having to compete with the U, but they also have to contribute. They have to compete with Central America, South America, Caribbean. These are spaces that normally don't have support and competition. Like, for example, Halo Infinite, when we entered in 2021-2022, there was support for Mexico Now there is no support for Mexico There's hardly any support for EU, even though EU is the second strongest region But mostly everyone is thinking about North America For Apex Legends last year, there was support for South America They just got rid of that, right? $100, like resources? Yeah, there's no, yeah, like, there's really good talent there

18:51 but like no one like the league doesn't want to develop it yeah right and like there's many mitigating factors as to why I don't necessarily need to speculate here as to what those are but there's like you know but it there's a disappointment that happens with these players where they're like look like infrastructure aside yeah there might be issues with internet whatever the case is but at the end of the day we have heart we want to compete we can compete we've been to the world stage. Why can we not continue to build upon that? Every time we move five steps forward, we end up moving 20 steps back, and then everyone forgets about us. And I

19:36 don't think that's fair. So for me, this continues to invigorate me. And one of the panels earlier, I think the folks with Bean talked about how they're prepared to fight and fight. And really build rapport within, like, local ecologies And I think that's, like, something where, like Things like Oasis end up really showing that there are people who want to see this happen, right? And so it takes a true, like, global communal effort to make it real So, for me, it gives me optimism, it gives me hope And it gives me, like, drive to say, like, yeah, well, you know what? Like, if they're not going to do it, then I'm going to fucking do it, right?

20:15 And, like, for me, like, truth be told I don't really tell anybody this But, people are gonna know, like, find out, like, one of my biggest motivators is spite I like showing motherfuckers that, like, I can do shit when everyone tells me no Like, I've had a recent call, or I've had folks back out of partnerships I've had recent calls of people saying, this is not working because it's taking too long This, that, and the third Fuck that, dude, I don't care Like, whether or not, like, they see the vision or They Are Willing to Put Up Money to Help Me at the end of the day

20:53 I'm building a force of nature and I gotta act as a force of nature so that shit becomes real facts, fuck it we ball exactly, that's it, that's it right, like, I'm not I'm not begging and pleading I'm just making shit real whether they're into it or not and when they're finally into it they're like, hey, niggas gotta pay a premium that's not my problem I said it's my last question, but I guess I have one more question and I'm curious, when did you realize that Crypto Web 3 could be a space where you could really have that kind of impact?

21:29 I don't know, it kind of clicked honestly really immediately I never felt like the endless drive to build something until I really understood how this could work even in theory, right? The minute I actually saw application, i.e. NFTs for example, everything just sort of fell into place. This is where I am forging my future in real time. I do not see any other path for me that makes sense. I hated working for typical B2B stuff. This it's not any shade to companies or whatever it just things felt far too slow or like there were too many I would say people were too locked into particular ideals right and like

22:35 I've always hated when people talk about like innovation or talk about like the need to do something new and it doesn't and it doesn't actually happen right like it was it's more iteration than innovation. And like, I know part of that is like the cycle of like software and like digital based applications. But I think at the end of the day, a lot of our work is still interpersonal. It's human, it's peer to peer. And those types of relationships and those types of like, those things you can't hack. Those things like, have their own They have a different time horizon in which success can be measured

23:20 And for me, crypto was a space where I could truly take the sensibilities that I had learned from being trained as a service designer And actually apply them in a real space Before I felt like I was only partially utilized with my skill set And now in crypto, I have been stretched in so many different ways I'm learning other ways in which the work that I've studied, at least academically and applied to a certain degree, has more meaning and power in these other environments. I love that. I think that's really compelling and I'm really excited for more people to learn about what you're doing. I know some people are super engaged in the competitive gaming space, the adventure gaming space.

24:07 Gaming is huge, it's a global culture and I'm excited to see you make the kind of impact you want to have. I think people are excited to own the platform, own the infrastructure, and really know that the spaces they're occupying are fair and equitable, and it sounds like that's what you're building for, so thanks again for sitting down and doing this with me, it's been a couple months coming, I would say, if not a year, so I'm super proud to have you on my show, and people like to know what you're doing, and thanks for doing it. Thank you, bro. You want to let people know where they can find you, online, socials, etc.?

24:34 Uh, yeah, so, um, Twitter at SirSuhay, S-I-R-S-U-H-A-Y-B, um, Telegram, same thing, you can also catch me on Warpcast at SirSuhay, S-I-R-S-U, um, if you want to learn about Blackhand, you can go to blackhand.com, B-L-V-K-H-V-N-D, we didn't do any vowels, we just did the consonants and we flipped the A's to V's because, yeah, Greco-Roman culture is cool, I guess, at least typography-wise. And then if you want to learn about our governance, it's blackhand.wtf If you want to contribute, you can easily just join our Discord, discord.gg slash blackhands We have community calls every Wednesday at 7pm We have content calls every Sunday at noon And then we have a town hall every second Monday of the month

25:29 What else? We're starting to do local meetups in New York City I'm announcing an official calendar on that next month But it'll start pretty much kind of like right after Lunar New Year If you want to get access to merch like this or other things that I have We're dropping a Lunar New Year collection actually in February So stay tuned for that I'll be doing like a little like tweet thing You can also find us on Twitter at Blackhand2 We got a lot of fucking things honestly I need to make a link tree to be quite honest But if you want to ask me questions direct, just hit me up

26:05 You can also find Stadium at Project Stadium on Twitter or ProjectStadium.com We have an official launch in February, so stay tuned for that Hell yeah, go tune in I'm definitely going to be at some of these community calls I'm very curious to see what governance looks like for the project you're building And I've been dropping the ball and showing up So showing up is half the word most of the time So I'm excited to lock in more of this year's support to come to meetups. All my New York niggas are going to be pulling up with their gamers. Absolutely. Yeah, we'll be doing meetups at Operating System New York. So it's a land,

26:36 restaurant, and bar. So you can get mixy, you can get some food, and we can beat niggas' asses in Tekken. It's great. Okay, stop playing with them. Yeah, and they also have a streaming booth too, so if you want to do like a live thing during the event, it's possible. I fuck with it. Yeah, man. Yeah, man. Well, 2024, niggas are locking in. Don't sleep. That part. Get tuned in. We them niggas worldwide, baby. Yes, indeed. Thanks for tuning in, and we'll talk See you soon, peace Deuces Oh yeah, true corn If at first you don't succeed What does it say, it says low battery? Yeah, I'm sure